Transcript 0:00 [upbeat rock music] All right, all right. Welcome on in to another action-packed edition of the Between the Hash Marks podcast. 0:09 As always, I'm Matt Lombardo, joined by my friend, colleague, mentor, and the purveyor of the Too Deep Zone, Mike Tanier, here on week zero in the NFL, deal week across the league. 0:21 Deal week, getting deals done, cutdown week, uh, so much going on. By the way, it's good to see you back on your feet. It's good to be back on my feet as, uh, my, uh, myself. 0:31 But right, we have all the deals done except for one. Yeah, one, one pretty big one that we're gonna get to- Mm-hmm... and, you know, we'll just let the cat out of the bag. 0:39 You and I were both really under the weather- Yeah... over the weekend when all of this was happening. 0:44 I test positive for COVID, I get the text message from you, or see it on social media that you're down and out after all of the partying in, in South Jersey at the Street Festival, and we- we- we are back from the dead just as the NFL i- is really back and shifting into gear. 1:00 But I'll tell you, man, but really unorthodox because that cutdown weekend, that's usually one of my favorite weekends of the year to dive into the news, and analyze it, and break it down. Mm. 1:09 I was just down and out, man. You were down and out, and you, you know, on the one hand it's like, uh, guy, guys losing their jobs and things like that. 1:16 It is, it is tough for the players, and you talk to a lot of agents so you know how tough it is for them that they have to work with these players. One person's crisis is another person's opportunity. 1:25 Sometimes these are times of elation or a guy gets off the practice squad or suddenly makes a, a roster. 1:31 In your case, you broke a story earlier where Jordan Poyer, who you interviewed a couple weeks ago, has returned to the Bills, which is something that he was really, I think, hoping to do deep down. 1:39 Y- yeah, it was always Buffalo or bust for him. 1:42 He was ready to retire, the Bills come calling, he signs there on the practice squad with the opportunity to perhaps earn an, a spot on the 53-man roster moving forward here. 1:53 Um, but, but a lot of news to get into, and before you break it all down, a little bit of housekeeping. 1:57 If you enjoy the podcast, if you enjoy the show, please go ahead and subscribe in the Apple Podcast Store, leave us those five-star reviews. They really do help grow the show. 2:05 If you enjoy Mike's brand of reporting, analysis, dad jokes, superhero humor, and the whole gambit in one nice package, subscribe to the Too Deep Zone on Substack. 2:14 You can check out Between the Hash Marks on Substack as well. You can even check out the, uh, show on my YouTube channel @MattLombardo975. 2:22 Uh, but really, Mike, the news of the week, a- at least for me, was kind of the most unexpected news of the week and the more unexpected developments, Trey Hendrickson. Yeah. 2:32 This felt like the outcome that was always destined to happen because even Trey Hendrickson's trade, trade request felt hal- half-hearted. Mm-hmm. 2:39 The Bengals couldn't afford to put even one more dollar in long-term escrow for guaranteed money on a long-term deal. 2:46 So at the end of the day, Trey Hendrickson gets $30 million, the chance to cash in next year, and he begins this season as the back-to-back sacks leader in the NFL. Uh, your thoughts on how this all went down. 2:58 We also, uh, you know, ha- have the, some resolution to the, the trade rumors that weren't involving Trey Hendrickson, uh, over the last weeks and months. 3:07 Well, this is kind of a big win for the Bengals 'cause they get him in body, mind, heart, soul, spirit this year because he's gonna be playing for the next contract. 3:16 It, it's not something where, like, he's coming in under the gun and like, "Oh, maybe I'll pull a hamstring," or something like that. 3:21 I don't think he's that kind of guy, but you know how it is, the motivation's a big part of it. Are... I haven't really been able to look at the contract the way it's laid out. 3:28 I know it's pretty much lump sum money, like they threw him a bag of money. Now, did- Right... did they... Uh, are there any guarantees moving forward that he doesn't get franchised? 3:38 I'm w- I'm wondering how this works that, like, he, it pretty much knows he will be free to set his own, uh, yeah, set his own agenda for 2026. Right. 3:48 There's been all kinds of reporting and speculation on both sides of that. I, I can't seem to nail down whether he got the no tag clause. 3:54 I, I would assume they're not signing the bag of money financial apology knowing or thinking that the franchise tag is looming over their head at the end of the year. 4:05 I, I, I don't think Hendrickson would, would go down that road. 4:08 Um, but it is interesting, Mike, because there was this school of thought that was evolving over the last couple weeks that maybe the Bengals would've been better off not re-signing Trey Hendrickson, having the cap space to then go out and sign a top safety, sign a cornerback, add a linebacker in the off-season to bolster what's been a, a criminally deficient defense that's been the reason why Cincinnati's missed the post-season. 4:32 This is why I think it works out best for both sides. 4:34 Hendrickson gets paid today, the Bengals have the luxury of having drafted Shamar Stewart to go ahead and do that this off-season with the cap money and the cap space that won't be locked up in a long-term Hendrickson deal. 4:47 And I'll say this, I'm not sure, I haven't looked at it, if they gave him lump sum salary and they try to franchise tag him, it's a minimum 20% raise of his salary. 4:57 So if they lump summed him, they would have to pay him, I, I, on the 20%, again, I'm a little bit under the weather this m- the, the, the exact number, a raise next year to the point where that's kind of a poison pill for them. 5:09 That may be how this is set up. Like, we could franchise you, but it's so super-duper expensive that it would be, like, like, that we can't afford it anyway, so we can't do it. Have you looked at the rest of... 5:19 Fir- first of all, did you see them in the pre-season at all with their starters? You saw them against the Eagles, right? It, it, it was very bad. 5:25 It, it, it was, it was, it was as if you decided to go into the stands- [laughs]... and find somebody wearing a Trey Hendrickson jersey and put him on the field. 5:34 It was like you, you know, i- instead of making Boomer Esiason, uh, pay to come in for the, the Ring of Honor ceremony, you look at the Ring of Honor, you look for the best cornerback and, and you tell them, "Hey, even though you're 47 years old, can you go play corner and bail us out?" 5:49 That's what that defense looked like. 5:51 Now, I don't know how much of that is Al Golden saying, "I'm not scheming, you know, one, one minute for this nonsense," or, or, or whether there should be alarms ringing that it's going to be really, really, really, really bad in Cincinnati.I- in both cases, that and the Commanders game, it was full starters out there for, like, a couple series. 6:09 And yeah, everything that we always say about pre-season is true. When guys are just getting manhandled, just getting manhandled, was one-on-one up the sidelines. 6:17 The Eagles guy who got cut, the Wilson kid, you know, and he's just catching balls over that cornerback. It's not like that cornerback was out there saying, "Well, it doesn't matter one way or the other." 6:26 That is going to be a bad defense. Now, it sh- it'll be passable. Hendrickson, like, covers a lot of sins. They now have a defense with one good guy. 6:33 I guess my question is, do we change anything in our mentality about the Bengals? Do we change who they are? Do we put them in the... We don't put them in the Super Bowl conversation because of this, do we? 6:44 No, I, I don't know how far removed they were from that conversation anyway because of Joe Burrow being there and then presumably, uh, starting faster because he wasn't holding out, or Ja'Marr Chase wasn't holding out in training camp. 6:56 They're, they're, like, knocking on the doorstep of that tier, in my opinion, but they were knocking on the doorstep for me beforehand simply because of Burrow and the offense. The, the defense doesn't change. 7:06 It, it, it is what it is. You have two pass rushers now. It, it's an upgrade. It helps. I don't think it wins them more than one or two more games. 7:13 Right, and then one of the pass rushers we're talking about, Shamar, the young guys, they take weeks to... Unless it's a, a Watt, you know, unless it's a Watt brother- [laughs]... 7:21 they take weeks to grow into them being able to have an accomplishment. If you look at the back end of that defense, it's guys we've never heard of. Now, now that was one that caught us off guard. 7:30 There was one that did not catch us off guard at all. Well, es- especially you. Well, espe- You know, you and I, you, you and I talked about this when I was on the practice field in Richmond- Yes... 7:39 on the training camp tour when Terry McLaurin came walking over my right shoulder down to dap up, uh, Joshua Harris, the Commanders owner- Right, right... that w- we knew right then a deal was getting done. 7:49 A d- a deal was getting done. This is where it was always headed. He ties AJ Brown as the sixth highest paid wide receiver in the NFL. He actually beats Brown by, like, $3,000 or something, a minuscule like that. 8:01 Uh, but Washington gets continuity with Jayden Daniels and Terry McLaurin, with a side dish of Deebo Samuel joining the offense. 8:09 And Daniels had the benefit of an entire summer working with the younger receivers they're trying to develop, taking up the reps that McLaurin would've had if he were in the building. 8:18 And maybe the biggest winner of all is Nose for Tanier, who- [laughs]... y- you know, you, you write the column, you write walkthrough, that by the time you read this, Terry McLaurin's going to have a long-term deal. 8:30 [laughs] You hang up a radio hit in, you know, Saskatchewan or wherever you were on the radio, and the news breaks that Terry McLaurin signed his deal. So, uh, kudos and, and hat tip to you. 8:41 Uh, you, you, you read this one straight. 8:44 Well, thank you very much, and part of it was getting the tip from you that the guys were dapping each other up, and Harris and McLaurin are, are, are being BFFs on the sideline during this contentious, quote-unquote, "holdout." 8:54 By the way, British Columbia. It was a radio hit in British Columbia, not Saskatchewan. I was close. You were- I was close... you were close. Yeah, it was somewhere in Canada. Um, here's... I, I, I'll hit you with this. 9:06 You, you're a b- you've been bullish on the Commanders from the beginning of the off season. Our buddy Jimmy Kempski tr- tracks the ages of every roster. He, he goes and he calculates and does average age. 9:20 Oldest roster since he's been doing it in 2012 belongs to the Washington Commanders. Oldest roster. 9:25 When you start talking about Miller, Ertz, Wagner, all those guys, a lot of second-tier guys that are, like, older that we don't even think about. Does that worry you at all? I think there's variations of old. 9:38 I, I think that from what I saw with Zach Ertz last year and what I saw, granted it's one training camp practice, but what I saw from Zach Ertz, you know, having eyes on him during training camp, Zach Ertz is a different kind of old than, than Von Miller is. 9:50 Zach Ertz looks rejuvenated Baker Mayfield-ian, uh, even at tight end in terms of w- you know, where he is in his career based on the production he put up last year and they're asking of him this year. I, I think that... 10:02 I still think when you talk about the tiers in the NFC, and certainly in the NFC East, it's the Eagles, the Commanders, and then we start talking about everybody else. 10:10 It might not be the widest window because of some of the older pieces on the roster- Mm-hmm... but the, the, the great denominator here is you have Jayden Daniels, and Jayden Daniels might be... 10:23 He might be Patrick Mahomes, right? He might be on that level w- we talk five, 10 years down the line. That's the equalizer of all this. I think that what encourages me more about Washington is the quarterback. 10:34 They've built a culture with the leadership there, and Adam Peters, the general manager, and Dan Quinn, the head coach, they seem to be working in concert building a roster that can win now. 10:43 You establish the winning culture, you draft well, supplement, and you re- retool from there. Kind of the inverse Packers, where you're waiting for everybody to develop. Yeah. They have the older pieces, the veterans. 10:54 Now it's just time to supplement it through the draft. Yeah. 10:57 Normally I'm super worried when I see that age curve, 'cause again, these guys start falling off the other side of it, and we just tend to overrate bigger names, and bigger names tend to be older guys. 11:06 I'd be more worried if I wasn't looking at, say, the Vikings roster and saying, "They've only got three cornerbacks on the whole roster." Right. Or the, or the Lions, who on cut down day to 53 cut down to, like, 26. 11:17 Like, like, they're not satisfied with anybody, and they're, like, throwing guys out there. The 49ers, everyone is injured. Uh, Matthew Stafford's ru- rubbing crystals on his back. 11:25 So, you know, everybody's got the worry. 11:28 So if the, the Commanders worry is that, well, maybe Von Miller, Bobby Wagner, and Zach Ertz have gotten old, that's a pretty good worry compared to, "I don't know who my number three edge rusher is, and my number two edge rusher's Marcus Davenport," who probably got hurt when I said his name. 11:44 Right. Or, or in, in the same division, I don't know that my pro edge rusher wants to even play and wants to even- Right... show up. I mean, they're... 11:50 E- every team has worries, but when you look across the NFC, Green Bay Packers, what, what are you doing at cornerback? Are, are, are you really turning to Bo Melton, a, a converted wide receiver, uh, a- as a cornerback? 12:01 You know, a- and they are. They seem intent on doing that. [laughs] Arizona, you've bought a lot of pieces on defense. 12:07 How quickly does it come together, and what the heck exactly is Ky- Kyler Murray even with Marvin Harrison Jr.? You know, you talk about- I like-... the NFC South. I like the Bucs. I like the Falcons. 12:16 Question marks with both. G- everybody has questionsThe Eagles and the Commanders have the fewest on that side of the bracket. By the way, I love the... Uh, what, what is Kyler Murray? It's his seventh season. 12:26 This is a... Yeah, I think we know the a- if we don't know the answer, that is the answer, you know what I'm saying? [laughs] But, but that's the thing with the Cardinals. 12:34 I don't wanna get down the weeds with the Cardinals and things like that. The Buccaneers are another example of a team. It's like, oh, Wuerffs, uh, they're not pupping these guys, which is good. 12:40 They're gonna play sometime first four weeks, but it's Wuerffs and Godwin. It's like y- you're talking about, you know, Pro Bowl caliber guys you're gonna be missing for a month. That's another question. 12:49 Commanders have that little question there as well, in that, like, some of these guys... I- if you see Jimmy's thing, by the way, he's got them all sitting at, like, the park bench feeding pigeons. It's very cute. 12:57 Uh, but like- You, you, you, you come, you come for the stick figures, you stay for the analysis... stay for the analysis, exactly. But you, you... It sounds like you're champing at the bit here to get to Micah. 13:06 You, you got Micah on the brain. Um, I, and I'm, I'm, I'm kind of done with Micah, but let's do Micah. Well, I think Micah's done with the Cowboys, so you guys kind of have something similar in mind there. 13:17 You know, spoke to someone in the column Four Downs on Monday. Uh, an agent familiar with, you know, multiple top-tier pass rushers around the league told me flat out that Micah Parsons wants out. Yeah. 13:27 He's trying to get out. David Mogulletta, his agent, is trying to get him out. Micah, another week goes by, not only without a contract, but you have Micah Parsons taking a nap on the trainer's table literally. 13:39 That happened during the preseason game. Just, I, I, I'll say borderline disrespectful activity on the sidelines of a preseason game, doing everything he can to, uh, get out of Dallas. 13:52 But Jerry Jones and the Cowboys still have all the leverage. Two or three big deals get done, Micah Parsons nowhere closer to the finish line. 14:00 I'll just throw this out there, 'cause, uh, again, we've been s- speculating, speculating, speculating. Okay, so Micah's doing that. Six, eight, 10 weeks ago, Micah was like, "Hey, you know what? 14:09 I'm gonna do whatever I can for this team. Hey, you know what? Business is business." Last year, it's like, "Hey, I'm not even gonna worry about my contract." He was up for a contract last year. 14:16 He just let the, the clock run. "I'm a team player. I love this sport so much. I wanna be a part of this team for life." 14:22 This guy's messaging has been super pro, super pro, super pro, uh, you know, company man, and by last week, he's lying on the trainer's table saying, "Am I injured? Am I bored? Am I not?" 14:34 Now, if you just did that to Micah Parsons, if the culture that Schottenheimer's put together, that J- or, or that Jerry's put together, Schottenheimer- Jerry... 14:42 yeah, yeah, yeah, Schottenheimer is trying to, like, survive it, did that to Micah, what's going to happen with George Pickens this year? 14:49 Yeah, that, that's gonna quickly, you know, become a ticking time bomb that's gonna go boom. I mean, it, it, it's just bound to happen, because Micah Parsons was a team leader. 14:58 Micah Parsons seemed all in on the Cowboys and, and, and now he can't get out of that situation quickly enough. 15:04 Something must have happened, and we know something happened according to Micah Parsons at least, in that meeting where he tried to have direct negotiations with... 15:12 Jerry Jones tried to have direct contract negotiations without David Mogulletta being there. Micah had two different agents unsolicitedly te- text me how out of line that was by Jerry Jones this week. 15:22 One of them sent me, uh, a screen grab of a Darrelle Revis post on social media where he basically said that it was unethical what Jerry Jones did and the, the NFLPA needs to be more aggressive, you know, combating these sort of things. 15:36 A former Jets player putting that out there. Right. It's just a bad situation all around, and I hadn't even linked this to the culture that Brian Schottenheimer is building. Talk about getting off on the wrong foot. 15:47 That, that, that team could really set itself back to the point it buries itself before September ends i- if this doesn't get res- results. 15:55 And it, it contrasts with, again, you seeing Harris and McClure and Dapen on the sidelines, 'cause they're not negotiating directly with each other. Right. 16:02 Which creates a level of deniability where both of them can look each other in the eye, 'cause whatever was said, that intermediary, that agent, and usually obviously not the owner, but a general manager or assistant general i- manager, are h- at odds so that there is not this rift from the people who have to work day to day. 16:17 Maybe the owner doesn't count in most situations as that, but Jerry is there day to day in Dallas. 16:23 So in addition to the fact that, like, it's financially, you know, it's, it's irresponsible and it's, and, and it's unethical, that it creates this friction on purpose, because it makes it more public and more l- hostile within the people in the organization. 16:36 So that's what... Yeah, a- and that's where, okay, like, I don't know if he's in uniform f- against the Eagles. I'm guessing he won't be in Eagle- uniform against the Eagles. 16:44 I think it's you who said, well, the Chris Jones situation, then everyone... Y- uh, Jerry's like, "Oh my God, you know, the Eagles ran for 500 yards and threw for 500 more. Here's all my money." 16:55 Um, I don't care about the Cowboys. Yeah. He comes back, he gets 17 and a half sacks, and they had a total 25 and a half sacks w- you know, because the rest of this team is already banana pants. They are not serious. 17:08 They have not put together... Eh, eh, they're, they're not fighting hard for each other, not fighting hard for that boss. 17:14 No, I, I don't disagree, and it's gonna be interesting to see how long this looms into the regular season. It, it could get done tomorrow. Uh, the, the reports that- Yeah... 17:21 he was getting a second opinion on his back, uh, today and, and who, who knows if that's, you know, a, a, a wink wink, nod nod to meeting with David Mogulletta to go over an offer and a deal gets done, uh, by Thursday morning before this even goes live. 17:34 You, you just never know. It could happen, or you could wake up on the Friday after the opener and conversations pick up steam because Micah Parsons isn't there. He's going to Matthew Stafford's back, guy. 17:47 He's going to- Not, not, not a great plan. He's going [laughs] he's going... Oh, no, right, yeah, 'cause you wind up, like, actually more hurt somehow as a result. So yeah, don't, don't do that. I got a, I got a doctor. 17:56 He writes prescriptions. D- it's, it's fine. I, I, I'll, I'll give Micah the number of this guy. He- what- whatever's wrong with you, he'll come up with something. It's fine. 18:04 So, so we move from breaking down all of the news off the field to looking ahead to the action about to be on it. 18:09 Next week, it's gonna be our prediction extravaganza where we make our Super Bowl picks and all those fun things. 18:14 Um, but, but today I thought it'd be fun, like, I, I'm really loving on the Too Deep Zone the Closing Argument series. [laughs] It, it's a great way to fill this week. 18:22 It's a great way for people to dive into each team, get the 30,000-foot view of what each situation is looking like with in-depth knowledge of each, and I thought we'd play a little bit of game, of a game here. 18:34 I, I want us each to pick-The best team to emerge from each one of your tiers. Okay. How does that sound to you? That's good. 18:41 I'm, I'm looking them up right now 'cause I always forget what I wrote moments after I wrote it, but I've got- You and I both. It's what happens when you write as often as we do. Yeah. 18:49 Right, exactly, and this was, like, about a 30,000-word thing that I wrote when I was partially sick. 18:55 Uh, so I also wanna thank Jerry Wapler, my, uh, my, uh, editor, for, for cleaning up some really big spills on, on aisle four. But, uh, yeah, let's do it. 19:03 I guess we would start then with the Super Bowl contenders, the best- Yeah, the Super Bowl contenders, I'm gonna, I'm gonna plant the flag here with the Eagles. 19:10 You know, again, we talked about fewest concerns of anybody on that side of the bracket. 19:14 I think that the Eagles and Howie Roseman have built the deepest and most talented roster across the league, and they're all back from a year ago. Jalen Hurts is back, not coming back from any sort of injury. 19:25 It's not a new quarterback. Saquon Barkley, fully healthy going into the year. Zach Baum, another year of comfort in Vic Fangio's defense. Jalen Carter, another year of just being an absolute menace up front. 19:36 They'll figure out the issues at, at corner just as they fell into Andrew McCubba stealing the starting safety job alongside Reed Blankenship. They'll figure that out. 19:47 I think it sets up really nicely for them, the early part of the schedule. You get to go into Kansas City early as a litmus test and a barometer. 19:54 So if we're looking at Super Bowl contenders from your list from the closing arguments, I, I'm, I'm, I'm taking the gavel and I'm, I'm gaveling in Philadelphia. 20:02 And just for people who hadn't read it, and please go check it out, the Super Bowl contenders were picked by DraftKings. Like, I used the odds to pick these teams- Yeah... which means it wasn't all my picks. 20:12 I would not necessarily have put the Rams and 49ers both on that list, but they had, like, there was an odds cutoff I picked and they were there. So of course, this is the best of the best teams. 20:21 Of course, I'm a grown-up Eagles fan just like you. 20:24 I'm picking the Ravens because FTN Almanac, the DVOA projections, Aaron Schatz says that was the team to beat in terms of the analytics when you go deep dive into everything they did last year. 20:35 Historically good team until they did what they did in the playoffs, and at some point you have to say that's either real or it's not real. What's funny, obviously I'm not gonna go through it, you, uh... 20:45 Folks know that Andrew Jackson, uh, Andrew Jackson. Look at you. Geez, wow. History teacher Mike coming out here. Wow. Jackson? The, Lamar Jackson and Derrick Henry are good ballplayers. 20:58 Um, every team, every good team is, like, missing a cornerback. You, you mentioned the Eagles, kinda missing a cornerback. Okay? The Ravens thought they got a cornerback. Ha ha, it was Hare Alexander. 21:09 [laughs] Now I, I, and by the way, he could play week one, but all the indications are he's been injured. Lo and behold, he has a long lingering injury. That's news. 21:17 Um, the Bills are another team where it's like, "Ah, we got, we, we drafted Maxwell Harrison." 21:21 Maxwell Harrison I believe is gonna mi- miss the year, so they brought back Trevi- Tredavious White because they like bringing back guys, Jordan Poyer, for example. Tredavious White got hurt. 21:29 So whenever we look at all of these teams, they appear to be, like, one cornerback short. 21:33 Um, and if the Ravens biggest weakness is they're only gonna have Alexander for his customary seven games a year, that's not much of a weakness. 21:40 So I think- Ma- make, make them seven games at the end and going into the postseason, and you just said that I, I don't know where the weakness is with the Baltimore Ravens. Right. 21:48 And, you know, watching them in training camp and you look at it's Marvin Hum- Marvin Humphrey over here, it's Jared Alexander, Alex- over there, it's K- Kyle Hamilton, newly minted highest safety- Yeah... 21:58 in the history of the league over here. Rookie Malaki Starks has an interception and a tip pass in the practice I happened to be at over there. Front seven, you, you upgrade the front seven, uh, drafting Mike Green. 22:09 You, you have the pieces there. You're playing bully ball with Lamar and Derrick Henry. You have Zay Flowers hitting his stride in his third year. And just for good measure, go out and you sign DeAndre Hopkins, right? 22:20 Yes. Just for, just for funsies. Uh, it- Right... it, it, it's, it's the people that you talk to, they repeat it. It's the Eagles and the Ravens are the deepest rosters in the NFL. 22:29 I think, Mike, they're on a collision course for the Super Bowl in Santa Clara. I really do. And that's a very popular choice. I looked at the odds. I don't have them in front, up. 22:37 It's probably, like, plus 800 for that exact combination, which is amazing odds for one one-two punch there. But again, if you go look at that, these are the Super Bowl contenders. 22:46 You can't go wrong because these are exceptional teams that were picked by, by the handicappers, not by me. For sure. Let's go to the playoff hopefuls and I'll give you first dibs here. Okay. 22:56 I'm gonna go make sure I remember who I picked here. No, not them. No, not them. Maybe them. No, not them. No, not them. All right, I'm gonna go with the Houston Texans. Okay? Oh, bust out. Yeah. 23:07 Well, a- a- and the FTN Almanac, who I just used as my support crutch to pick the Ravens, wasn't high on the Texans, but what I've seen in the preseason, not just watching preseason games, but getting a lot of updates coming out of the camp there, the offensive line has not been fixed fixed, but it's been duct taped together pretty good 23:26 to the point where it's like they've got a new system. Uh, uh, C.J. Stroud should be fine. He's got the very good receivers out there. It won't be absolute clown show in front of him. 23:36 He'll be able to, uh, put a stable offense together. And, and the defensive side of the ball, you talk about a team that's not a cornerback short, not a defensive lineman short. 23:46 Actually, they lost Autry, but they still have like five guys out there, including Daniel Hunter and Anderson. That is a very strong team. 23:53 It's a weak division, um, and the Jaguars have a much easier schedule, and I, I go through that in the article. But the Texans, it's almost like you, you sleep on them a little bit and how good they can be. 24:04 Um, but a- in that division, you can wind up winning 14 games. I, I think you pencil in six wins out of the AFC South. I, five and one at the very minimum. You're gonna- Very minimum... 24:13 you're sweeping the Titans no matter what. You're gonna sweep the Col- Colts are in absolute free fall down into the abyss. Um, and then it's like, well, the Jags you could probably split with. The Jags are pretty good. 24:22 Five and one right there. Now, I think they get, they get the... I, I don't have it in front of me. Maybe I should pull it up right now, hey, Vamp, while I try to find this. Yeah. 24:30 I mean, th- they're the team that, that people always kind of slip their mind, but, but I mean, C.J. Stroud is there. You take, think about the weapons they have on offense around him. 24:39 They g- get more wide receiver help in the NFL draft. The defense is there. DeMeco Ryans has the winning culture. 24:46 I, I admit we sleep on the Texans because it seems like they, they fall into this butting their head against the glass ceiling in the AFC in the playoffs, but the glass ceiling happens to be the Kansas City Chiefs that a lot of teams run into and can't get through. 24:59 So you'll see when, when push comes to shove in the postseason-If they can get it done. But if Stroud continues on the upward trajectory, and Derek Stingley Jr. 25:08 continues to be a defensive player of the year caliber corner, and you have Will Anderson, you have those pieces up front, look out, man. 25:16 Yeah, and what I was saying about the schedule I got now, they do draw the Ravens and the Chiefs and the Bills. 25:21 And in the NFC they draw the 49ers, who should be very tough if they're healthy enough, and they draw the Buccaneers. 25:27 And if you compare that to the other schedules in the AFC South, all those teams get the second, third, fourth place teams, and it's a much weaker slate. So the Texans will be- get tested week in and week out. 25:37 But like you said, five and one, six and one, six and O in that division, with that defense, Stroud healthy, that's a really strong team. Yeah, just get in if you're them. 25:46 I'm gonna go with, uh, the team I've been all about for several years, Cincinnati Bengals and, and Joe Burrow. You know, you look at- I thought it was gonna be the Broncos. 25:54 Well, yeah, I, I, I am all in on the Broncos, and I think that they're gonna be the, the team that could wreck some people's day in the postseason, but I don't think that they're a fully healthy Joe Burrow, fully loaded offense, firing on all cylinders. 26:07 I mean, look, Joe Burrow leads the league in passing a year ago, and if Andy Reid cares even, you know, half of my pinky about the week 18 game against Denver- Yeah... 26:17 maybe they get in, even with a historically awful defense. Defense can't be that bad again, I don't think. I don't think it can be that atrocious. I think Burrow could be on a 5,000 yard, 50 touchdown caliber trajectory. 26:31 I think they get in, and I think that Joe Burrow is the one quarterback that strikes the fear of God into Patrick Mahomes. If they get in, I think they can make a really deep run. 26:41 For, for me, with that team, it's like I think all of us say, man, the floor is seven and 10, because they're gonna score a million points. 26:49 And then the, the ceiling, maybe you have a higher ceiling, but it's like, it's like 10 and seven. They have a tough division. They have a very weak defense, even if it's improved a little bit. 26:58 And if you say, well, the defense has gotta get better, there's always a chance also that the offense declines a little bit. 27:02 If you look at who they have at guard right now, their two guards are not guys that you look at and say, "Oh, th- this is a, this is a wall of granite in front of Joe Burrow." 27:11 But, you know, it's hard to argue against them at some level. It's like, well, yes, we have Joe Burrow, you have Ja'Marr Chase, you have Tee Higgins. 27:16 There's gonna be some games where it's gonna be 38 to 34, and you're either gonna win or gonna lose. 27:21 You can't say [laughs] that about more than half the teams in the, uh, uh, in the NFL, so that makes the Bengals automatically dangerous. 27:27 [clears throat] Yeah, give, give me, you know, minus three, minus seven inside of a minute, Joe Burrow's probably the quarterback that I want, and I think that they're gonna be in a lot of situations, uh, where, where he's going to need to win them the game. 27:39 Mm-hmm. He's gonna have to go out and do it. Uh, the meh teams. I, I, I love a good meh team. What makes a team... What makes a man go meh? That is the question- Meh... I'm asking. 27:48 The New England Patriots make you go meh, and maybe a little bit better than that. [laughs] Right? Because they- Uh... 27:53 they did a- all they needed to do, they checked every box in the off season, they put the cap space to use, they bring in Mi- Milton Williams, they bring in Carlton Davis, they, in the draft, go and they, they get the top offensive tackle on the board, they get Trevion Henderson, you bring in Stefon Diggs. 28:09 The pieces are there for Drake May to, to take the leap. 28:13 And if they make the leap, I'm not gonna say they're gonna challenge the Buffalo Bills, because I think the Bills are in that Super Bowl tier very comfortably and very easily the team to beat in the AFC East. 28:24 But I could see, uh, Mike Vrabel co- with better coaching and, and more talent all around, top to bottom, I could see New England pushing for a, a, a nine to 11 win season. What they have is a pretty easy schedule, too. 28:38 Um- Yes... I'm gonna read off the start of it here. Raiders, Dolphins, Steelers, Panthers. Now, I'm gonna put in a, a win for the Dolphins, 'cause the Dolphins all wanna crawl up and die. 28:47 I'm gonna put a win for the Panthers, 'cause I think that they, the Panthers, are kinda overrated. And then the Steelers or Raiders, like, who are these guys? 28:54 Um, it's very, very possible you just get three and one off the bat. I would say the Raiders and the, the Patriots have a lot in common in terms of, like, the sort of, uh, the rebuild that they're going through here. 29:04 And then later on I can see there's a little stretch of Saints, Titans, Browns. A Saints, Titans, Browns stretch in October, that's, 'cause that's a, that could be- Three and O... three and O. That's a nice rest. 29:14 That's a nice three and, three and O, and like, uh, and like guys sort of like get w- more with the program and understand. 29:18 And, and Vrabel can yell at them after, "You only won by seven in this game, we should have won by 17," and the guys are receptive to that and all that. 29:24 So [clears throat] I don't mind the idea of them being a wild card team at all. Um- That's how, that's how that's you scheduling The Citadel in November, after the college football playoff rankings come out. 29:34 I mean, that stretch, that, that just is what it is. It's a nice little NFL rest it. It's three Citadels. I mean, again, like we're just gonna read that out again, because it's like Saints, Titans, Browns? 29:43 Are you kidding me? That could be Tyler Shuck, and then, uh, okay, so it's Ward, but Ward has nobody around him and he's sort of figuring things out. And then Dylan Gabriel. Dylan Gabriel [laughs], yeah. 29:55 Or Shador or Bailey Zappe. It could be the Bailey Zappe homecoming revenge game. Again, again, I guess the Patriots- I'm telling you, don't sleep on New England. They're over the nine. 30:05 If the number is nine, don't sleep on the over if you're banking three wins in your back pocket in November. 30:11 And that's a good way of looking at it, 'cause whenever I talk about these teams as like, well, this is my surprise, this is my sleeper, you've heard me say it, put a number on it. Yes. Put a number. 30:20 You know, like, I think it's a, uh, nine and eight, I'm gonna play it, I'm gonna play o- over eight and a half, or I'll play over nine and a half 'cause I like the number on it. 30:26 But if you put a number on like that, it's reasonable. It's reasonable. When you start saying they're gonna challenge the Bills, it's like [clears throat] would you put a dollar on that? 30:32 Like, or would you put that dollar on buying some gum, right? And that's a different thing. So I like that. I like the Jaguars. Ooh. One reason- Ooh... 30:41 I like the Jaguars is because shots and the DVOA projections and FT and Almanac like the Jaguars a little too much, I thought, um, where they have them winning that division outright. And 30:53 the, yeah, the thing I keep going back to is the team that we are comparing them to was last year's Mac Jones or Trevor Lawrence is obviously injured but playing version of the Ja- Jaguars. 31:04 Whereas, uh, with Doug Pederson out there probably canceling practices after like July... 29th or whatever, whatever. You know how, you, you remember Doug's practices. Yeah. 31:13 [clears throat] So now when you come in with Liam Cohen who's gonna bring an attention to detail, more of a short passing offense, you get Lawrence healthy. I'm not one of these Lawrence deniers. 31:22 I've got enough denial in my soul with Justin Herbert that I can't carry it over- He's fine. He's fine. He, he's fine. 31:28 He, he, he's, he's not the generational prospect we were promised, but they haven't built around him enough of an infrastructure for him to really be that guy. He doesn't have Tee Higgins and, and Ja'Marr Chase. 31:40 He doesn't have Justin Jefferson. He doesn't have Travis Kelsey. He doesn't have A.J. Brown and, and Devonta Smith. 31:46 But he has a Travis Hunter now, and if there's ever a year for him to make the leap with Brian Thomas and Travis Hunter, this is the year. 31:55 With, with, with a supposed quarterback whisperer coming in as a head coach, this is the year for Trevor Lawrence to be Trevor Lawrence. 32:02 And if that's what the, the numbers are indicating, mixed with, with Shotzi's insight, I, I, I can dig it. I can get behind the Jaguars challenging the Texans in that division. 32:12 Right, and, and, and Liam Cohen's offense of a million screens- Yes... okay, where you can, you can play point guard a little bit there. 32:19 Um, and, and, and I don't think the latter day version of Peterson's offense was really like that. They also have an easy schedule. And no, now no schedule will sound easy after what we just talked about. 32:28 Um, but, uh, you know, they get a little stretch where it's the Titans, Colts, Jets in November and December, uh, where you could have a, a Colts team that's in free fall, and who knows what the Jets will be at that point in the year. 32:39 They've got these other skids. Look, don't compare it to the, um, Patriots. Compare it to the Texans- Yeah... who are gonna be out there against all these, like, uh, first place teams every week. 32:48 Yeah, the Jaguars get some other first, they get the, the, uh, Chiefs in there as well. 32:53 But there's a chance where they just rise up if they split with the, the, the Texans, where all of a sudden they almost have similar records because they had an easier slate. For sure. 33:03 So, uh, yeah, um, that was, that was a ton of fun. I'm all about it. Um, I, I will say this. I think that the metrics and the, the odds makers are a little too bullish in my opinion on the Pittsburgh Steelers. 33:18 I'm not even sure that, uh, I saw them in the playoff hopefuls bracket with, with you I believe it was, from the DraftKings. 33:26 Uh, Ralph Vacchiano, who's a good friend, covered the Giants for a long time at Fox Sports, he had them- Yeah... on the a break or two away, basically the second tier in, in his power ranking tiers. Yeah. 33:37 I'm still glad the tiers of season is over, but I'm, I am, I am very bearish on Pittsburgh, Mike. I don't see it. 33:44 That, that, that wide receiving core behind, um, uh, b- behind DK Metcalf looks like it's just a bunch of moving parts still trying to figure out what it's going to be. 33:54 Aaron Rodgers does not look even as mobile this July as he looked last November. You're banking on that defense clubbing people upside the head and winning a lot of games 13 to six. 34:07 I don't think there's a lot of 13 to six games to be had. And you, you laid eyes on him. Mo- most of us have not seen him. You laid eyes on him in July. Ugh. Not much movement. 34:17 Right, right, a- and there's usually not much movement in seven on sevens and all, but yeah, I, I, the thing about people like mind wiped, I, I feel like December and we were talking about, about the owner's kid and like bringing people in the, i- into the, uh, uh, the, the clubhouse and everybody getting fired and these terrible games, and these games where the Jets were not even competitive and, and, uh, you know, all this, uh, whirlwind around Rodgers. 34:41 And then like three weeks passed and it's like all of our brains went memento. Yes. And everyone forgot everything, and they look at his stat line as like, "Oh, he had a pretty good year." 34:50 Well, a- and I know what the numbers are, I don't have it. Like 3,800 yards and 26 touchdowns or whatever he had, that's a good season. It's like, no, no, you lived through it. It was a couple weeks ago. 34:59 It's all fluff, it's all padding, it's all check downs. It's all like there was a late touchdown in a game against like the Cardinals or somebody like that where they lost by two scores. He was bad. 35:09 He is now not a good quarterback. So you're resting this on almost this mentality where, "Oh well, it was the Jets last year, now he's in a better situation." No, that's not what happened. No. 35:20 The Jets customized their roster for him. They, they brought in Randall Cobb and all of his buddies and, and Nathaniel Hackett was there. Yes. Everybody from Green Bay. 35:27 It was, it was the Packers East, uh, headlined by Aaron Rodgers. He nailed it, by the way. 3,900 yards and 28 touchdowns, so, uh, hat tip to you. 35:36 He's, he's just, he's a shell of the shell of a quarterback that he was in New York. It, people forget. You wanna talk about getting brain wiped, 35:43 I, I, I still remember Detroit going into Lambeau on Sunday night in week 18 punching the Packers in the mouth, knocking them out of the postseason contention, ending the time that, that- Right... 35:55 Aaron Rodgers was in Green Bay. He was the shell of himself in 2022. Right. And that's- Right... pre-Achilles. It, it, it has been a long time. 36:04 He, he won the MVP in, in, in 2022, a shell of himself in, in 2023, but you know, it's been a long time since Aaron Rodgers was the Aaron Rodgers we remember. 36:14 Yeah, and by the way, we, we b- butchered those years 'cause there's a lot of confusion in our brains. You were right, it was 2022 season. Yes. Well, that game might have been in 20- never mind. 36:23 What you're saying is, I- i- is very true. The end of that year, he's out there, he's like a throwaway machine for a Packers team- Right... 36:30 that's still in the playoff contention, and they got, and they got smoked in that last game. And, and, and a sack target. He was a, he was a, he was a tackling dummy in the pocket. 36:36 He was a tackling dummy in the pocket, so he would like clock the ball and he'd walk out shaking his head, and that's what we saw all last year. Yes. 36:42 Was him shaking his head, going to the sidelines, and then two weeks later somebody'd get fired or something like that. 36:48 And, and, you know, the idea that we can walk away from that and say, "Well, according to these raw stats, he still has something left." 36:54 And Arthur Smith, this w- notorious quarterback risk whisperer that Arthur Smith is, whose, whose entire... 37:01 accomplishments in life besides being born a billionaire is, "Derek Henry, we should get him the fucking ball more." Great. Right. Great. You're a genius. You're a genius. Go to the Falcons and see what happens. 37:11 "Huh, I think I should run triple reverses with Jonnu Smith." You're a crazy person. Oh, and by the way, now you have Jonnu Smith again, so you have your favorite windup toy, and now you're dealing with Aaron Rodgers. 37:21 Rodgers is gonna drop back, not like what he sees, and start rolling around. 37:24 If he starts rolling to the right and waving guys downfield and saying, "Roman Wilson, you know what I'm, what my hand signals mean," it- "Uh, Scotty Miller, go over there." Yeah, yeah. This is gonna be absolute decay. 37:36 Change direction- Yeah... decay. Okay, hold on. Do, do, do, do, do. [laughs] Gonna be bad. [laughs] It is not gonna be good football with Cutler. 37:51 [laughs] That's- This went completely off the rails, as only Aaron Rodgers could send us. I, I have to cough really bad, so hold on. Yeah, no, I, I, well, you can mu- mute your mic. There you go. See, you get it out. 38:05 I, I understand, you're getting over being sick. I'm getting over being sick as well. We're, we, we, we are, we're playing through it because we're professionals is what we- Yeah, this is, this is a hell of a podcast. 38:15 Uh, [laughs] we had... You solicited questions on the internet, didn't you? I did. I figured it'd be a lot of fun because we're kind of in this no man's land before previewing games and- Yes... recapping what happened. 38:28 Yes. Uh, ask the people some questions, and we had two or three really good ones. I had one too on my end. I don't know if you got, so you do yours, and then I'll do mine. Okay. 38:36 The, this one comes in from Beau Harmon on Threads. He asks, "Who are your breakout candidates for this year, and give me your Comeback Player of the Year favorite." 38:44 Um, so wh- which one would you like to tackle first here? I think I'll do Comeback Player of the Year. I wanna look at the odds though, man. Uh, I, I would like to head in the direction of Mr. 38:54 Trevor Lawrence, who is eligible. Remember, you have to be eligible, so you have to have been injured last year. He was injured. You can get him at plus 500. 39:03 Um, again, I think he's going to bounce back, even if a lot of it is schedule and a lot of it is scheme. Voters don't care about that. Right. 39:12 Voters are gonna see Trevor Lawrence out there, he gets 4,000 yards, gets 11 or 12 wins, he's gonna be a popular candidate on that end. And, uh, why don't you give me your pick? 39:20 And I have the odds ready if you, uh- Yeah, I'm, I'm gonna go chalk, you know, because why wouldn't I go chalk, right? Uh, I'm gonna go Christian McCaffrey because- Yeah... 39:28 it's gonna have to be Christian McCaffrey because there's not a lot of meat on that bone in the offense there, uh, because obviously Brandon Aiyuk's still going through issues. 39:36 The passing game is gonna be Ricky Pearsall and two dudes they signed off of, uh, other teams' rosters 'cause everybody's hurt. And Jordan Mason, who was a great handcuff last year, is a Minnesota Viking. Yes. 39:47 I could see Christian McCaffrey will have 150 yards, close to, closing on double-digit touchdowns or more. 39:53 If San Francisco wins that division again and McCaffrey's the driving force and he reminds people of what he is when he's at his ba- his best, I'll take Christian McCaffrey. 40:02 Uh, I thought you were gonna say DJ Chark, and I was like, "Uh, I hope not." Uh, McCaffrey, by the way, is not chalk. Obviously a, a popular choice, plus 300. Certainly a very logical choice. 40:12 Again, he's 100% eligible, he's a high-profile player, all the reasons you mentioned. Chalk would be, here are the two favorites, Dak Prescott at plus 275, wouldn't touch it. No. Aidan Hutchinson plus 275. Hmm. 40:24 That, that's pretty good value. Mm. That's pretty good value, yeah. Others along the way, J.J. McCarthy, he will not win the award. People will say he didn't really come back because he never had done anything. 40:34 Nick Chubb ain't winning it. Hey, here's one. Daniel Jones at plus 2,000. Are you feeling it? No. No. No. Donate that money to a nice charity. Put it in a tip jar. Yeah, t- tip your barista. 40:48 Uh, uh, Andy Richardson plus 3,500. Maybe throw a dollar down just for fun 'cause I don't like money. He could be the barista. Now, [laughs] now I'm going to admit, [laughs] I don't have a breakout handy. 41:04 I should get all this ready 'cause I'm gonna be doing radio. Yeah. Uh, but you surely have a breakout, so, so what do you got? I do. 41:09 Uh, I'm gonna go Caleb Williams here because I think that the shotgun marriage is gonna be a really fruitful one. And how many times have we said this? 41:17 I can't remember a team that's done more to set up their young quarterback than the Bears have, fixing their offensive line in the span of one offseason with veterans, top r- tier free agents. 41:28 You draft Colston Loveland, you draft Luther Burden. 41:31 You already had, uh, Cole Kmet in place, so you can run a lot of two tight end sets, which takes a lot of pressure off, uh, your quarterback making big throws down the field. Rome Odunze is there. D.J. 41:42 Moore stretches the field a little bit. The weapons are around him. 41:46 Uh, I think the Bears surpass expectations, and I think Caleb Williams plays his way into that, like, top five, top 10 production number, and people are gonna look around and say, "Wow, where did that come from?" 41:57 Well, it came from him being the number one pick in the draft a year ago and having to, uh, withstand the three-ring coaching circus in, in his rookie year. 42:04 [laughs] And no one's, no one's gonna say, "Where did that come from?" Because it's like, oh yeah, Ben Johnson came in and restored r- law and order. So like, oh, we see it. I think it'll still surprise a lot of people. 42:12 Perfectly reasonable choice there. I'm, I'm, by the way, I'm racking my brain for, for, for one here, but there's a lot of really good second year players. I, I don't have that, like, perfectly- I know... 42:23 uh, like, oh, this kid was banged up last year and came back. Caleb Williams is an excellent choice. Malik Nabers is in the con- should, should be in the conversation too a little bit, you would think. 42:32 He's sort of breakout breakout. Like, sometimes I'll pick the guy and it's like, but didn't he already break out? So I'm trying to fi- I'm, like, and, and I'm trying to do it off the top of my head. 42:40 It's not coming to me. Let's just both pick Caleb Williams. I like it. Well, let's go with the question that you have from your end because it might have made my list and I don't want us to double up. Okay. 42:49 Well, this comes from Derek Rhett, not to be confused with Eric Rhett, who played for the Buccaneers years ago. 42:55 Derek Rhett asks, "Prediction on Ashton Jeanty's season behind a crap Raiders O-line and Pete Carroll's commitment to the run being dead for the last seven-ish seasons." 43:06 Did you happen to have that one?I, I had it at the bottom of my list, so c- but, but I'm glad that you, I'm glad that you, uh, saw it as well. 43:13 Um, I, I'm actually really bullish on Ashton Jeanty, and it's for the same reason that I'm so bullish on a Christian McCaffrey comeback y- player of the year award, is because there's not a whole lot else out there. 43:25 You have Brock Bowers and, and, and what else in, in Las Vegas. I think they're gonna run him into the ground. I think he's going to reward them handsomely for doing it. 43:34 I think you're gonna see a lot of highlight reel level plays. 43:37 You're gonna see Saquon Barkley's rookie year, where you have three-yard run, three-yard run, 56-yard touchdown, four-yard run, two-yard loss, 48-yard receiving touchdown. And, and it's gonna be that kind of year. 43:48 Give me 1,150 yards and seven touchdowns, uh, for Ashton Jeanty as a rook. Well, actually I, I... 43:54 My, my, my exact projection was gonna be 1,307 yards and 11 touchdowns, uh, with 91 receptions, 'cause I just grabbed Saquon's rookie year. Literally just have Saquon's rookie year. 44:05 You're playing for the bad team, there isn't that much else to do, you are exceptional. I guess we could have used Bijan's rookie year, that would've been another one that you c- could have gone with. 44:14 He's a s- he is a very special running back. And I don't know, Carroll's going to find ways to feed him the ball, and Chip Kelly's gonna find ways to feed him the ball. Carroll's out there- Yes... 44:22 talking to the defense and going, "Rah, rah, zis, boom, bah," on the sidelines. 44:25 The latter day Cha- Ch- Chip Kelly, who has a pretty different offense than, than the one we saw in Philly years ago, is gonna be looking for ways to get that young man the ball. 44:33 I don't know how terrible their line really is. I think it's probably just below average. Colt Miller's a good ball player. 44:39 Um, uh, Jackson, Jackson, Jackson, Powers, Johnson, Johnson, Powers, Jackson, I think was a pretty good prospect a year or two ago at center. J- uh, Offensive Rookie of the Year, right? 44:50 That's, this is the prohi- prohibited- Run, run, runaway. Yeah, ru- run, runaway with it in my opinion. 44:54 I think he's a generational prospect, generational running back, and he's what they're gonna build their offense around. 44:59 Uh, next question comes in, Scott Larson on Blue Sky, "Could Adam Thielen in the slot be a blocking and shallow target for J.J. McCarthy in the passing game, or is this just a nostalgia tour?" 45:10 No, it's not a nostalgia thing. Jalen Nailor is hurt. 45:13 Jalen Na- Nailor, their regular slot, who's been a very steady slot for the last couple years, was, has been very helpful through all the injuries, stepping up, he's got an injury that's gonna limit him or possibly sideline him, I'm not really up to date, couple, first couple weeks of the year. 45:26 So you bring in Adam Thielen, who knows the system and knows the culture and knows his role, and he's gonna come in for the first couple weeks and do some of that slot stuff. 45:35 If he wasn't s- close to toast, he would still be in Carolina as their slot security blanket guy for Bryce Young. 45:44 But he has- Yeah, and I think that what Scott lined out there was the blocking and shallow passing target, short passing security blanket for J.J. McCarthy, that's the plan, right? 45:53 And, and the reason that he's there is to be the slot and be the, the potentially number two or number three passing option, uh, with Jordan Addison being out as well on the suspension. That's the plan. 46:06 But I spoke to somebody over the weekend who basically laughed off the trade, um, a- and thought that Thielen is pretty close to washed, if not washed already. So the plan is for this not to be a nostalgia tour. 46:17 What it turns out to be, I think, is anybody's guess. I think by week six it'll be a nostalgia tour, because, uh, you'll have Addison back and Nailor back. They, uh, i- Nailor's a better player than Thielen right now. 46:27 That's what- Yeah... the, the, they have to realize. 46:29 And I was pulling up Thielen's numbers from last year, a- and he had this big game against the Eagles where he went 9/102, but end of the season it was like five catches for 43 yards, like where he's catching these underneath passes and doing very little with them. 46:43 You can get that from another guy, and I think that the, um, Vikings wanna get that from Nailor and from, uh, the, um, Hockenson, their tight end, and that Thielen is going to wind up being sort of a leadership guy after everyone's healthy and off suspension. 46:56 Last one before we go here, "Is keeping undrafted free agents on the 53-man roster the sign of a shallow roster?" Specifically seeing this concern relating to the Vikings. Um, it's from FXI3 on Blue Sky. 47:08 Mike, I don't know that I necessarily read it that way. 47:11 I think that that's just an endorsement of your scouting department and your believing, um, these guys pounding the table for guys in the draft process, that you had seventh round grades or after on, you were able to sign them. 47:24 It's a testament to these guys making the roster during training camp. 47:28 I, I think it's a testament that you might not be sold on some of the veterans on your roster, or you had an aging roster that you're looking to hit the reset button on, and this is a quick, cheap way to figure out if these guys can be those pieces. 47:40 But I don't think it's an indictment of it being a shallow roster at all. What do you say? I don't, I don't think so, no. It can be. I think there are times when it can be. Not in the Vikings case. 47:49 First of all, you go back to Ivan Pace, some of the other guys, the last couple years, very good track record at identifying UDFAs, making sure they get a fair chance to compete for these spots on the roster. 48:00 A lot of times teams are precious about their draft picks, and the UDFAs are not ever given, like, meaningful reps or paid attention to or coached up, because they gotta get that fifth round, sixth round pick. 48:09 Not so much the case in Minnesota. They give these guys opportunities. Flores has the chance to work with the guys he wants to work with. 48:15 So i- if, if this was, we were talking about the Browns or the, the Saints or something like that, like yeah, this is a shallow roster issue. That's not the case in Minnesota. They're happy- Right... with the guys. 48:24 Now, of course, they've got holes. Again, we talked, I guess we talked off-camera about their cornerback situation. That's a problem, okay? Yeah, and, and that just is what it is, and it's still a really good defense. 48:33 Brian Flores can mask some of those issues at cornerback. Uh, I think that m- the Minnesota story is interesting. 48:39 I, I think that they might be a little bit underrated in the NFC North, but I don't think it's because of some youth movement that that's gonna be why they do or don't make the postseason. 48:48 Uh, Mike, what do I have coming up at the Two Deep Zone over the next few days? Well, the final installment of the closing arguments for the stinky poo teams comes tomorrow. 48:58 So I, I know a lot of my readers have been waiting for me to just tee off and start ripping the Dolphins and the, and, and the Colts and all these other teams. Tomorrow is your day. Not everybody gets ripped, okay? 49:10 Some of, there's some optimism. The Giants have reason to be optimism- optimistic. I think the Jets do too, some of these other teams. But the stinky poo teams come tomorrow. 49:17 Friday there is, uh, the last installment for a while of Signature Moments, where we talk about the signature moments of the New Orleans Saints. Perfectly timedPerfectly timed. 49:26 Uh, a 20-year anniversary of Hurricane Katrina landing in New Orleans, and we'll be talking about that moment, but also, like, obviously happier on-the-field moments in the, in the history of the Saints franchise. 49:36 What do you have coming up? Looking forward to reading all that. Make sure you subscribe to the Too Deep Zone on Substack. 49:41 Uh, we move the Five Burning Questions series to the AFC, where we are racing to the finish line to get this series done. Uh, NFC South published today, if you wanna go check that out. 49:53 A mail bag on Friday, where people can pose their questions to me, and then I'll ask them to my agent, executive coach, former player sources, get their thoughts on what's happening inside the league. 50:03 And Monday, Mike, it is the annual predictions column. Okay. The four downs predictions, my Super Bowl, uh, pick, my pick for all of the top awards, some random thoughts on the season ahead. 50:16 Looking forward to getting that out there on Monday morning. Oh, thank God. I can just read it and then just pick a different person, and then I'll be ready for the podcast. Less work for me, thank heavens. 50:25 Make sure- Honestly, no, this, this sneaks up on me every year, because- Yes... 50:29 it's, it's not like I'm picking on you, it's like I'm gonna be on my, uh, British Columbia radio show and, and, and the one that I do in Alberta, uh, and some of these other... "Uh, what, what's your Super Bowl pick? 50:38 What's your MVP pick?" And every time I'm like, "Oh my God, I'm being asked that?" Well, yeah, dumbass, it's the beginning of the c- NFL season. You've been talking about football for weeks and weeks and weeks. 50:48 These guys have been talking about the, the, the Canucks and the, and the- The Canucks... at, at the end of the- And the Raptors Yeah... and the Maple Leafs. Right. 50:56 A- a- and, and it's like, well, now we wanna talk about this, and it's like, oh my God, Super Bowl. Super Bowl pick? 51:01 Um, so I'll read your column on Monday, and then I'll pick somebody different just to be contrarian, and we'll have amazing content for, I guess, Tuesday when we podcast. Yeah. Yeah, it'll be, it'll be a lot of fun. 51:12 He's Mike Tanier. Make sure you subscribe on Substack to Mike Tanier's Too Deep Zone. It's mandatory reading every single week. Follow him on Blue Sky at Mike Tanier. 51:20 You can subscribe to Between the Hash Marks on Substack. If you're a fan of my insider reporting, features, and analysis, check out the show on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, and follow my YouTube channel @MattLombardo975. 51:32 You can subscribe to the podcast there. Leave us those five-star reviews and ratings. They do help grow the show. Mike, this was a ton of fun, but guess what? Next week we get to talk about real football games. Right. 51:44 We can preview the actual games that are happening. Hallelujah.
